On Thu, 3 Aug 2000 22:58:29 -0500 Fred Terry wrote... >At 8:16 PM -0500 8/3/00, Robert B. Waltz wrote: >>On 8/3/00, Leif Silli wrote: >> >>[ ... ] >> >>>My little problem is this, Fred: I don't understand what your decision >>>is. I would like you to draw up some examples of what should be >>>concidered transgressions and what should be concidered allowed. How >>>could you know that NW in year 2000 should be able to read emails >>>delivered as files in the Finder when you opened your list back in >>>internet stoneage? Yet, that's what has happened. If this is supposed to >>>be the kind of list you say, your ban on discussing this issue here makes >>>my wonder what you concider on topic. >>> >>>Since I can't see the logic here, you better give some examples or work >>>your house tidying idea better out. (Especially I wonder if you makes any >>>difference between >>> >>>In my view NE is clearly on topic. Another issue is that it take up so >>>much space right now that. So perhaps it would be good -for that reason- >>>to make another list. >> >>I think the example is quite obvious: If it relates directly to using >>NisusWriter, it counts. So a question about "How do I use Nisus >>to get NESY to do such-and-such?" is perfectly valid. If the >>question is purely about NESY, though, it's irrelevant. >> >>Admittedly the question isn't always asked in terms of Nisus. >>But the comments about ICWord do answer a Nisus question: >>"How do I, a Nisus user, view Word documents?" >> >>It's a clear, simple rule, to my mind. (Truth to tell, I find your >>example much harder to understand. How can a question about NESY -- >>not Nisus and NESY; a question about NESY -- possibly be relevant >>to a list about NisusWriter? Would you ask a question about Excel >>on a list devoted to Word?) >Leif, >Bob's message answers your question about list content. If your >message is about using NESY with NisusWriter, it's on topic. If >your message is about opening Cyberdog files with NisusWriter, or >reading from a Eudora mailbox with a NisusWriter macro, it's on >topic. If the message is about using iLiner with NisusWriter, >it's on topic. I am glad to hear this. >If, however, your message is about importing a Eudora mailbox >into a FileMaker Pro database, this is the wrong list. If your >message is about FileMaker Pro being hands down better than >MS Access, this is the wrong list. Trying to decide which monitor >would work better with your Mac? Wrong list. I understand. Very clear and obvious examples. But it is good you are mentioning them. >Any clearer? To my way of thinking, this is very simple. Why post >a message on a NisusWriter list about buying hardware? With all >of the content-specific mailing lists and newsgroups, you'll get >more hits on a list devoted to the discussion of computer >hardware. You might get a couple of opinions here, but you should >consider it a fluke if you get expert information on monitor pitch. >However, you'll get expert information about solving a NisusWriter >macro problem here. You wouldn't really think of asking a >NisusWriter macro question on the Linuxppc list would you? I see that I have some transgressions to repent for... Just like even some of the those that criticize others for Off topics also have. >In response to Raymond's >>Now came Fred, the mythology. The first time I have heard about >>him, or may be the first time I have noticed that he exists, is >>now. Fred tells us that in his house he will not >>host those who do not play his game. Is his house is ours any more? >Yep, I'm a myth: http://www.tidbits.com/iskm/iskm3html/pt1/ch03/ch03.html >and search for Fred Terry. I've spent most of my time in the >background managing the details of the list. I use NisusWriter >every day, but I don't consider myself the expert that some of the >rest of your are. I am very glad to have been partaking in your mythical creation for several years ! >Now about your comment >>I have to say that this attitude that it is we - the NE users - that >>have to clean the house and find us another place to live, is not >>responsible at all. It might be that NW have become such a rich and >>usable program that it isn't room for all its uses and misuses on >>one list anymore. But putting it that way is something else than >>saying that NE is an off topic matter. Because clearly it is not. >Shrug. We just disagree. No, we don't. I think it is ok that off topics go away. So we agree. And, it is OK to say that discussing how well NE functions with PhotoShop or non-Nisus WP's is off topic. But there are a lot of cases where it is not that obvious. I am just glad to have heard you say that anything we can do with NW is related to NW, including working with mail to and from NEmail. >I've always said, and included in the >sign up info, that the list is about NisusWriter. The folks on >the list who have fussed here and to me privately are complaining >about messages that don't have anything to do with NisusWriter. I'm >not making any comment about whether or not NESY is good; I'm >just calling for a halt to off topic posts. They knew what to do to finally get their wishes into factual policy ;-) (Working behind instead of - or in addition to - on the sceene.) >I actually thought I >was taking the right path by letting everyone police themselves >instead of switching the list to moderated mode and rejecting >all postings that were off topic. That would be to take a very strong role in getting the list on your track. And I'd welcome it if you start taking a stronger role, through advices and prescriptions on and off the list. And why not for a not too long period put in in moderated mode, so people can be honest about what they think is on topic and get everything that you disagree with in retun. Another thing that perhaps should be discussed in this conjunction - and that would be quite easy and powerfull, is if the members should be given a maximum amount of messages per day or week ? Some lists have such a limit. That would be - I think - a very effectfull way of getting people to talk about just the most important things. And some of us would definitely reach the limit, some more often than others. If you want to try this, I reccomend setting a limit *per week* and not *per day*. If possible, one could also think of limiting the amount of byte per member. Something which could perhaps get people to cut down on their uneccessary quotations or to elaborated signatures. Or long letters for that matter. >But I've already discussed this more than I said I would. I my view we are just discussing what your decision is supposed to mean in daily life. Allthough of course it is difficult to draw the line... Leif
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